Wednesday, October 18, 2006

By the pricking of my thumbs…

Inside me lives a crusader, an inquisitor, a stalker and a harpy. There’s a mad despot in there sharing space with a moist-eyed idealist.

You don’t want to give me any power.

Oh, I’d be okay sometimes. I might be a good fray-steward part of the week, but on Thursdays I’d morph into a sadistic teenager while you’re all out for lunch. Or I’d compliantly follow my pack into a wasteland of social engineering, only to look up one day to discover we’d eliminated everyone but ourselves and the most persistent of idiots.

And I’ll always work things to my own benefit. Always.

Trust me.

The great thing about the Fray is that it’s not regulated by users like me, and the value of posts is not determined by those who have collected the most points or who belong to the biggest posse, but by those who make the best arguments.

In advance of the fray-redesign, there was discussion of various ways to apply user ratings in order to allow each of us a customizable view. How do you feel about the fray adopting this kind of feature now, having experienced first hand the effects of the Truster User system at dkos, where users have the means to up or down-rate posts regardless of their merit, giving them power to exclude posts and posters based on their own personal tastes, and that of their friends?

And now that you've been blogging awhile, what other features would you like to see?

(You do realize that without a quick toggle with which to flag worthy and unworthy posts, all we’ll have in our arsenal is words. Are words enough?)

…something wicked this way comes.

Word.

_____________________________________________________________

Excerpts:
MsZilla reconsiders the wisdom of user-ratings systems.

Geoff responds: If it's merely power to assign scores in tandem with a voluntary choice to heed scores or not... Doesn't seem like it should have the same impact.

MsZ: Yes, it does . . . A group of people can still downcheck something to a level no sane person would ever want to open it . . . If you make it so everyone can do it, all you've done is made sure everyone on the site can exercise group summary judgement.

Geoff: I really do feel that we owe it to readers to make a configurable viewing experience that helps people with varying amounts of time to kill navigate the site efficiently.

On an earlier thread, MsZ’s diagnostic: Other than the technological flaws, the "problems" everyone keeps blathering about with the Fray are PEBKAC. The problems exist between the keyboard and the chair.
. . .
You can hang bells and whistles off this place until it looks like a bloody Christmas tree. They'll keep asking because if you do that then they can blame the site. There is no amount of code that will fix the core problem. Each improvement is just another opportunity to find a new and improved way to act like jerks to each other.
_____________________________________________________________

slatefray strayflea asterafly flaytears leafystar staryflea flarestay layfaster seafartly yefaslart farystale fasteraly realyfast fartsealy rastfaley stearflay eslytfraa artsfaley flaterays afelarsty sylfareta latfaresy teasflyar earlyfast staryfale yarfetals

7 comments:

Anonymous said...

#2. We already have that option. It might be nice to employ as in a blog comment, however, where the user is automatically linked to a profile and/or a homepage. (You could do that if you wanted to, you'd just look like an ass.)

I'm realizing more clearly that the only thing special about Slate's fray is the community. What we lose by branching out is the nearness of our peers--our opinions sort of drift away to mroe loosely attached islands. (The magazine does provide a tool to replenish it, I admit, and also provides topicality.)

But E. was right to observe that happening in the bigger blogs too. Interested to see if this thing gains steam.

K

wagtheslate said...

Dawn:

The lines in your post were problematic. Shorter next time.

TenaciousK said...

Hello Swit:

Funny - those two on your "humor" thread are sure going a long way to supporting ZB's point - the only substantial thing separating them and us is a whole bunch of Tempos with little increments of banning and censorship authority.

I really didn't expect to get the kind of reaction we did. On the Fray, with the threads left standing, counterarguments have the opportunity to coalesce.

[chuckle] some wiser mind than mine should write a post contrasting various board structures and forms of government. At Slate, what we have is sort of a stewardship, but it's really being run like a benign (debatable by a few whack jobs) monarchy, or (as asserted by various conspiracy fans) an oligarchy.

What Kos has is a more representative form of self-governance - like a Roman Republic, sort of. Citizenship is granted as a privilege, the mob has their say, and then there's another branch of government who can provide a check. That they DON'T provide an adequate check is really the problem – no real recourse from the mob. No judicial system, and a mostly absent executive branch.

Ironic that Kos is making it's own argument against pure democratic rule - those with the axes to grind, regardless of reason, are the ones running the show. Zealotry wins out over whatever noble idealism might be found in the place.

What do we want the Fray to be, from a self-governance perspective?

Well personally, I don’t really trust any of you jokers. I vote all the power stays with Geoff (or whomever happens to be in that position). People can always appeal to WAPO if they don’t like what he’s doing.

As an alternative (not that we really need one), people could vote for governing representatives (say – a small number of votes per user). Candidates would have to be nominated, though, or we’d have one of the same problems plaguing US politics – the people most enthusiastic about being in office are many of the ones we should most want to keep from office.

I like it like it is – nested threads, sequential posting, one or two overworked editors haphazardly scouring the board, a bunch of tattletales – you know, that noble Fray culture we’re apparently trying to lord over the Kossies. Most of the other stuff would be relatively easy to implement, I imagine – no limits on searched history, an ability to gather and present your own favorite posts and replies somewhere...

And better freakin’ servers (and no pull-down ads cleverly placed between content and the navigation/control bar at the top of my browser). Isn’t that what we’re all really the most upset about?

TenaciousK said...

uhm, how 'bout "Slatepeter"?

I'm pretty sure that some of the women attached to the men on the board would find that very funny.

Or not.

MsZilla said...

The search thing is most definately one of those "technical issues" I was talking about. The current design made sense when you were .ASP and trying to deal with this load.

Now that the thing is .NET you have a lot of options for dealing with large datasets and displaying them effectively on the page while actually making it more performance efficient that you didn't have before. It needs to really be thought through and it can't be done in the wild because to make the technical decisions accurately you need to know the structure of the database and a whole bunch of important alphabet soup that shouldn't be just floating around out here in the aether.

august, you're the first person I've seen to bring up the chilling effect of the new "topical" requirement. Especially now that the BOTF is being such an unrepentant brat.

BTW - if BOTF's issues have to do with it being "unanchored", why not just make an orphaned article about vermiscious knids or something, place it out there, and have it be the new anchor. Is there something technical I don't know about that would make this a bad idea? I know it's Kludge, but the whole damned board is a legacy holdover.

To get a little mileage out of it, you could even have a bi-weekly Fray contest to submit a piece to live on it.

And I want a new car, too. ;)

Anonymous said...

Dawn: One thing with that is that Slate's a little late to the game. There are several Blogger-type software user clusters (not the right techie lingo, I know), which seem to be consolidating. Blogger is now part of Google, for example. There's a blog interface with MySpace, probably one with Yahoo, etc. What's the point of having a new Slate blog thingie?

Better probably for Slate or WaPo to license one of 'em and give it as an option to Fraysters signing in. Give them an automatic Blogger profile, with an option to claim a blog address. It would allow a parallel portal into the general blogosphere. Maybe that's what you've been saying all along.

Switters, TK, Ender: Yeah. I didn't want to mention any names, but that's been my thought too.

Keifus

TenaciousK said...

regarding names...

Latin for "free"

solvo - which is equivalent to "free floating." - Think solvent, or absolve.

Extrico - which is equivalent to "freeing from entrapment." Think extricate.

Licens - which is like "entitled" - like, license (duh!)

Eripio - "to snatch away, take away / rescue, free"

Tabula Eripio comes up in google a few times, but never in English, which implies it may be grammatically correct.

Latin Grammer - one more subject I know almost nothing about.

Just a thought...